programming for fun

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BasicCoder2
Posts: 3323
Joined: Jan 01, 2009 7:03

programming for fun

Postby BasicCoder2 » Aug 08, 2018 21:03

from viewtopic.php?f=7&p=250406#p250406
MrSwiss wrote:
If I where you, I'd stop stressing the "rolling my own", because the reason
for that, is your own inability, to ever write re-usable code ...
Meaning: You would by now, have your own, self written gui-library!


MrSwiss I program for fun and I am an amateur. I get a kick out of programming for the same reason someone might get a kick out of painting or writing even if they are well below professional standards. If I had the ability to write professional code I would learn to use a professional GUI library for very good practical reasons. I reuse code all the time although I might modify it for a particular purpose. And for fun I have worked on my own very simple GUI library of controls along with a GUI editor designer that generates the required source code. Why attack people not up to your standards? If you were a professional tennis player would you turn up at a amateur tennis match and attack them for being lousy at the game?
MrSwiss
Posts: 2876
Joined: Jun 02, 2013 9:27
Location: Switzerland

Re: programming for fun

Postby MrSwiss » Aug 08, 2018 21:10

Being an amateur, doesn't mean automatically, that one "must" turn out "lousy code".

But I think, we've had all of that, already discussed ...

Not wanting to improve ones abilities, is my point and, teaching noobs bad practices,
as a direct result.
UEZ
Posts: 213
Joined: May 05, 2017 19:59
Location: Germany

Re: programming for fun

Postby UEZ » Aug 08, 2018 22:13

@MrSwiss: Actually, I did not want to answer your verbal ejaculation - just ignoring you, but you behave like an a$$h0le!

As I said earlier, you might be right with some of your criticisms, but the way you say it is offensive and humiliating to other users in one way or another.

You destroy the motivation and create only aggression towards you. Is that what you want?

It's the sound that makes the music.
BasicCoder2
Posts: 3323
Joined: Jan 01, 2009 7:03

Re: programming for fun

Postby BasicCoder2 » Aug 08, 2018 22:41

MrSwiss wrote:Not wanting to improve ones abilities, is my point and, teaching noobs bad practices, as a direct result.


It is your assumption that I don't want to improve my abilities or that over the years I haven't gotten better but there is a limit for everyone. You can practice painting, tennis, writing that best selling novel and still not really get much better at it.

So you think there are noobs coming to this forum and thinking BasicCoder2 really knows his stuff this is the guy to learn from?? I think they would be a little bit more discerning than that. A decade ago when for a moment I had thought seriously about programming I turned to what I perceived as professional publications (Deitel and Deitel suggested to me by a professor of mathematics who taught programming) to try and learn C++. I did not turn to amateur code on some C++ forum. I soon realised I wasn't that keen on programming and decided it was only ever going to be a hobby.

I think it is more about your distaste of less than the latest best practice and old time retro programming.

What is it you use FreeBASIC for? What is the reason you are here?
If you can't be bothered with those beneath your abilities that is fine you can just interact with your peer group or do what one of our best contributers seems to have finally done.
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=26157
MrSwiss
Posts: 2876
Joined: Jun 02, 2013 9:27
Location: Switzerland

Re: programming for fun

Postby MrSwiss » Aug 08, 2018 23:20

BasicCoder2 wrote:So you think there are noobs coming to this forum and thinking BasicCoder2 really knows his stuff this is the guy to learn from??
Well, your ideas on solving problems, are quite OK, sometimes even better than that.
(It's more the way you code, that's questionable.)
BasicCoder2 wrote:I think they would be a little bit more discerning than that.
That is the problem, noobs can't discern anything, because they are noobs ...
(What others may see straight away, remains hidden to them, for a certain time, at least.)

BasicCoder2 wrote:What is it you use FreeBASIC for?
I've started coding in GW-BASIC, then Asm, then PB and Asm ...
(never attempted C/C++, not my syntax, except some Arduino stuff)
Later on, I went into graphical programming (using own DLL's written in FB),
as well as some additional utilities, written in FB (professional use).
But also, as a hobby / trials / exercises, to improve my abilities e.t.c.
Last edited by MrSwiss on Aug 08, 2018 23:23, edited 1 time in total.
grindstone
Posts: 598
Joined: May 05, 2015 5:35
Location: Germany

Re: programming for fun

Postby grindstone » Aug 08, 2018 23:23

UEZ wrote:...but you behave like an a$$h0le!
To me he rather appears to behave like an autistic: Mathematical skills close to Einstein and manners close to a hooligan. Not out of bad faith, but because he simply isn't able to understand the mechanisms of a harmonic social coexistence. In addition to that he understands neither irony nor metaphores (like he proofed in the past).

So let's be not too unrelenting to him. I'm sure he struggles hard to improve his social skills.
jj2007
Posts: 944
Joined: Oct 23, 2016 15:28
Location: Roma, Italia
Contact:

Re: programming for fun

Postby jj2007 » Aug 08, 2018 23:27

BasicCoder2 wrote:... do what one of our best contributers seems to have finally done.
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=26157

That was a fun thread indeed ;-)
deltarho[1859] wrote:
Joshy wrote:I must learn to ignore online trolls and idiots

Actually, it is like having arthritis ... Take a troll or an idiot and give them a right 'ear bashing'. Not enough is not helpful.
sancho3
Posts: 316
Joined: Sep 30, 2017 3:22

Re: programming for fun

Postby sancho3 » Aug 09, 2018 7:28

DJ. Peters has been back since that thread.
It doesn't seem like he is as active as before but one should never say never.

A little drama in the forums here eh?
You don't have to go too far back in anyones posted code to realize that there is a dozen ways to approach a programming concern, and no one is perfect.
BasicCoder2
Posts: 3323
Joined: Jan 01, 2009 7:03

Re: programming for fun

Postby BasicCoder2 » Aug 09, 2018 8:08

sancho3 wrote:A little drama in the forums here eh?

I don't have any problem with MrSwiss expressing his views, I just disagree that I am going to addle the brains of newbies, assuming there are any real, never programmed before, newbies here in the first place. If any arrive they can be directed to some quality programming tutorials. I replied in this section as I didn't want to mess up RNBW's thread. MrSwiss gets grumpy because I don't seem to share his need to become a more advanced programmer but honestly we all have limits on how much time we want to devote to each of our interests. MrSwiss, when he chooses to do so, can be very helpful to programmers such as myself and it is much appreciated.
Tourist Trap
Posts: 2445
Joined: Jun 02, 2015 16:24

Re: programming for fun

Postby Tourist Trap » Aug 09, 2018 15:48

sancho3 wrote:A little drama in the forums here eh?

You will ever have borderline people that seem taking pleasure (or fun if I keep in the mood of the topic) in sitting somewhere where this is not comfortable to make a judgement. Neither a really useful friend, neither totally useless. Neither a really good behaviour, neither a behaviour you want to condamn because you would be in a contradiction. How can we tell someone to start being tolerant and not tolerate him not to be some or some other thing. Borderline people are what you can wish to your worst ennemy :D
BasicCoder2
Posts: 3323
Joined: Jan 01, 2009 7:03

Re: programming for fun

Postby BasicCoder2 » Aug 09, 2018 20:43

MrSwiss wrote:
BasicCoder2 wrote:What is it you use FreeBASIC for?
I've started coding in GW-BASIC, then Asm, then PB and Asm ...
(never attempted C/C++, not my syntax, except some Arduino stuff)
Later on, I went into graphical programming (using own DLL's written in FB),
as well as some additional utilities, written in FB (professional use).
But also, as a hobby / trials / exercises, to improve my abilities e.t.c.


They term "graphical programming" is used for another way of writing programs including for the Arduino.
https://www.visuino.com/
https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/al ... interfaces
And there is a popular visual like language that seems to be promoted to teach children to code called Scratch. I am not sure if that is good programming practice for newbies. For me that would be a tedious way to "write" code. However Visual BASIC made producing an editable GUI interface a breeze.

What sort of graphics did you program?
MrSwiss
Posts: 2876
Joined: Jun 02, 2013 9:27
Location: Switzerland

Re: programming for fun

Postby MrSwiss » Aug 09, 2018 21:19

BasicCoder2 wrote:What sort of graphics did you program?
None of course, they're all pre-defined (switches, sliders, leds, dialgauges e.t.c.).

You've got it the wrong way around, grapical programming is:
Instead of typing code, one draws a cirquit, as in electronics, using digital/analogue building blocks,
which are then wired together (some are visible, others are not visible, just logic, e.g. EXOR-Gate).
In short: one is designing the cirquit (the programs logic) in a graphical way ...
(This requires a totally different *frame of mind*, than normal coding does.)
There are two things to consider, the programs logic and, the visual appearance of visible components.
(like sizing of input/output fields, dials, plots, incl. other required parameters, color, thickness e.t.c.)

The Arduino stuff, was done in Arduino-C, using the native Arduino IDE.

Best known programming environment for graphical programming is: LabVIEW © National Instruments.
I'm currently using: ProfiLab-Expert © Abacom (which is a far cheaper alternative, but 32bit only :-(( ).
BasicCoder2
Posts: 3323
Joined: Jan 01, 2009 7:03

Re: programming for fun

Postby BasicCoder2 » Aug 09, 2018 22:24

MrSwiss wrote:
BasicCoder2 wrote:What sort of graphics did you program?
None of course, they're all pre-defined (switches, sliders, leds, dialgauges e.t.c.).
You've got it the wrong way around, grapical programming is:
Instead of typing code, one draws a cirquit, as in electronics, using digital/analogue building blocks,
which are then wired together (some are visible, others are not visible, just logic, e.g. EXOR-Gate).

Way beyond anything I could program as a mathematical model of a complex and dynamic electronic circuit is something beyond me.
The closest I came was thinking about graphical representations was how to write a self wiring array of NOR gates that could evolve a simple digital circuit function.
This was as far as I got.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=17624&hilit
Last edited by BasicCoder2 on Aug 10, 2018 5:00, edited 1 time in total.
MrSwiss
Posts: 2876
Joined: Jun 02, 2013 9:27
Location: Switzerland

Re: programming for fun

Postby MrSwiss » Aug 09, 2018 23:47

BasicCoder2 wrote:The closest I came was thinking about graphical representations was how to write a self wiring array of NOR gates that could evolve a simple digital circuit function.
This is a prime example, showing clearly the advantage of coding graphically (versus ordinary
code writing):
Using a NOR-Gate block (can be indefinitely duplicated) and, drawing the connections (wiring
them together). Then (for input), a +5V and a GND block, with some switches connected to
the NOR's then, some output indicator(s) e.g. LED's, already finished! Run it ...
(All you really need to know, is the truth-table of the used Gate(s).)

To be truthfull: there are already full adders, as finished blocks in the environment, among
many other goodies ... (one can even build whole chips with Gates alone, like 7-segment
decoder's), but also a lot of analogue components, for direct analogue signal processing ...

If you have 100 Euro's to spend, I'm certain that you'll enjoy it, even if for trials only ...
(Btw: german /french /english -- are the supported languages, I'm using the english version.)
deltarho[1859]
Posts: 1652
Joined: Jan 02, 2017 0:34
Location: UK

Re: programming for fun

Postby deltarho[1859] » Aug 10, 2018 0:45

For some, FreeBASIC is a paint brush;
for others, it is simply a spanner.

The spanner has no desire to be faced with a blank canvas;
it just wants to strip an engine down.

Some paint brushes look down on spanners;
I think that they should mind their own bloody business.

<smile>

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